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Well, I won't be playing Jak 3.. that's for sure


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I have read through the majority of the first page threads regarding how 'bad' this game is and I honestly cannot agree with any of the points that have been brought up.

 

I played this game on PS2. Scrap that, I played it to death on PS2. I got it day one, played it countless times over as a child (I was only like what, 5 or 6 years old?) and never, ever had a problem with the game's apparent 'difficulty' or 'bad checkpoint system'.

 

It is not difficult, but challenging, something that goes amiss in many games nowadays. Sure, for some sections I may have had to reload a few times. But never to the point where I was pulling my hair out in frustration (I tend to never rage at games in general though). The game offered me enough of a challenge where, when I passed the section, I had an immense feeling of satisfaction. It made me want to continue. I like a challenge in games and Jak II gave me enough of that whereby I couldn't get enough of the game, simply put.

 

The checkpoint system... I see no problem with it. Seriously. Just like MMDE said, I find it to be perfect. Too many games hold your hand just as he said and give checkpoints every minute or two. This game doesn't do that (which I commend Naughty Dog for doing) and, for all the reasons MMDE mentioned, makes a perfect checkpoint system.

 

And contrary to about every reply to this thread, I absolutely loved the city. Exploring it was a blast, I could hop into a car and drive around the city for hours. The atmosphere in this game is spot-on and the free-roam is perfect for me.

 

Then again, this is my opinion, and as a gamer I tend to find games that are generally regarded as bad quite fun. I tend to only look for the positive points in a game and the negative points, I never notice, to be honest.

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I have read through the majority of the first page threads regarding how 'bad' this game is and I honestly cannot agree with any of the points that have been brought up.

 

I played this game on PS2. Scrap that, I played it to death on PS2. I got it day one, played it countless times over as a child (I was only like what, 5 or 6 years old?) and never, ever had a problem with the game's apparent 'difficulty' or 'bad checkpoint system'.

 

It is not difficult, but challenging, something that goes amiss in many games nowadays. Sure, for some sections I may have had to reload a few times. But never to the point where I was pulling my hair out in frustration (I tend to never rage at games in general though). The game offered me enough of a challenge where, when I passed the section, I had an immense feeling of satisfaction. It made me want to continue. I like a challenge in games and Jak II gave me enough of that whereby I couldn't get enough of the game, simply put.

 

The checkpoint system... I see no problem with it. Seriously. Just like MMDE said, I find it to be perfect. Too many games hold your hand just as he said and give checkpoints every minute or two. This game doesn't do that (which I commend Naughty Dog for doing) and, for all the reasons MMDE mentioned, makes a perfect checkpoint system.

 

And contrary to about every reply to this thread, I absolutely loved the city. Exploring it was a blast, I could hop into a car and drive around the city for hours. The atmosphere in this game is spot-on and the free-roam is perfect for me.

 

Then again, this is my opinion, and as a gamer I tend to find games that are generally regarded as bad quite fun. I tend to only look for the positive points in a game and the negative points, I never notice, to be honest.

 

I just don't think there's much motivation or reward for exploring the city. They could have done a lot more with it. It's a huge lost opportunity. Instead they make it hard to get through the city, and you have to get all over the place, longer and longer distances each time. It's kinda annoying. There's also a lot of luck elements to many of the challenges that just makes it sometimes completely impossible to complete them no matter how well you do. That's just unfair and not good gameplay, but most of the actual game had nothing of this. There's also heavily missable collectibles and no way to control where you miss stuff etc.

 

In any case, I don't agree with most of the negative things most people complain about in this thread. the above is what bothered me.

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  • 2 weeks later...
I have read through the majority of the first page threads regarding how 'bad' this game is and I honestly cannot agree with any of the points that have been brought up.

 

I played this game on PS2. Scrap that, I played it to death on PS2. I got it day one, played it countless times over as a child (I was only like what, 5 or 6 years old?) and never, ever had a problem with the game's apparent 'difficulty' or 'bad checkpoint system'.

 

It is not difficult, but challenging, something that goes amiss in many games nowadays. Sure, for some sections I may have had to reload a few times. But never to the point where I was pulling my hair out in frustration (I tend to never rage at games in general though). The game offered me enough of a challenge where, when I passed the section, I had an immense feeling of satisfaction. It made me want to continue. I like a challenge in games and Jak II gave me enough of that whereby I couldn't get enough of the game, simply put.

 

The checkpoint system... I see no problem with it. Seriously. Just like MMDE said, I find it to be perfect. Too many games hold your hand just as he said and give checkpoints every minute or two. This game doesn't do that (which I commend Naughty Dog for doing) and, for all the reasons MMDE mentioned, makes a perfect checkpoint system.

 

And contrary to about every reply to this thread, I absolutely loved the city. Exploring it was a blast, I could hop into a car and drive around the city for hours. The atmosphere in this game is spot-on and the free-roam is perfect for me.

 

Then again, this is my opinion, and as a gamer I tend to find games that are generally regarded as bad quite fun. I tend to only look for the positive points in a game and the negative points, I never notice, to be honest.

 

You said the game doesn't hold your hand. I agree completely. It does much worse. It stands in front of you pushes you back and gives you the finger while doing it.

 

When I am playing a game my main enemy should not be the game mechanics, bad camera angles, shoddy weapon aiming that practically requires you to be still to aim properly which you CAN'T do, unresponsive controls and ridiculously stupid vehicle controls.

 

If they had fixed all that crap the checkpoint system would have been much more bearable. But a game ceases to be fun when you are dealing with all of that garbage.

 

I got the platinum for this game but I HATE myself for it. It was not worth the anger frustration.

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You said the game doesn't hold your hand. I agree completely. It does much worse. It stands in front of you pushes you back and gives you the finger while doing it.

 

When I am playing a game my main enemy should not be the game mechanics, bad camera angles, shoddy weapon aiming that practically requires you to be still to aim properly which you CAN'T do, unresponsive controls and ridiculously stupid vehicle controls.

 

If they had fixed all that crap the checkpoint system would have been much more bearable. But a game ceases to be fun when you are dealing with all of that garbage.

 

I got the platinum for this game but I HATE myself for it. It was not worth the anger frustration.

 

The fact that I barely died when not on purpose (collect skulls) while playing through the game should tell you there isn't anything wrong with the actual game. It is just a bit more difficult than you thought it would be. Jak 1? I died a couple of times on the fire boss, else I think I failed one challenge once or something throughout the entire game. The controls are far from unresponsive. The vehicle controls are certainly not ridiculously stupid. Just face it, you probably just aren't that good at games like this. I grew up on games in the same genre that was way harder than this game. Go 100% complete Crash Bandicoot 1, or 105% Crash Bandicoot 3. Then come back and tell me this game is hard. Except for some of the dumb luck based challenges, this game is like 3/10 difficulty compared to CB1's 9-10/10 or CB3's 8/10. I know you are saying you are fighting against game mechanics, but you don't mention any of it except controls that are just fine and a camera angle that works if you know how to use it.

Edited by MMDE
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The fact that I barely died when not on purpose (collect skulls) while playing through the game should tell you there isn't anything wrong with the actual game. It is just a bit more difficult than you thought it would be. Jak 1? I died a couple of times on the fire boss, else I think I failed one challenge once or something throughout the entire game. The controls are far from unresponsive. The vehicle controls are certainly not ridiculously stupid. Just face it, you probably just aren't that good at games like this. I grew up on games in the same genre that was way harder than this game. Go 100% complete Crash Bandicoot 1, or 105% Crash Bandicoot 3. Then come back and tell me this game is hard. Except for some of the dumb luck based challenges, this game is like 3/10 difficulty compared to CB1's 9-10/10 or CB3's 8/10. I know you are saying you are fighting against game mechanics, but you don't mention any of it except controls that are just fine and a camera angle that works if you know how to use it.

 

Well congratulations Mister Gamer God.

 

You are elite and I commend you. As I have grown older I have decided that I just dont have the patience for stupid crap. If you can put up with that I seriously admire you, because its something that I need.

 

This is coming from a guy who loved Demon Souls.

 

They should have added in an easy mode for people who want to just experience the game, because it does have a good story and nice characters.

 

Before you respond with "wheres the fun if there is no challenge"

 

Sometimes we DONT want to be challenged when playing a game. We just want the experience of seeing the story.

 

But hey thats my opinion. This is just one platinum I wish I had not put in such effort to earn.

Edited by merrick97
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Well congratulations Mister Gamer God.

 

You are elite and I commend you. As I have grown older I have decided that I just dont have the patience for stupid crap. If you can put up with that I seriously admire you, because its something that I need.

 

This is coming from a guy who loved Demon Souls.

 

They should have added in an easy mode for people who want to just experience the game, because it does have a good story and nice characters.

 

Before you respond with "wheres the fun if there is no challenge"

 

Sometimes we DONT want to be challenged when playing a game. We just want the experience of seeing the story.

 

But hey thats my opinion. This is just one platinum I wish I had not put in such effort to earn.

 

I got (P) in Demon's Souls in 5 hours, and I messed up then, go check my trophy card. It's possible to do in 2,5 hours. xD

 

This is not the kind of game you play for just enjoying the story... It's Naughty Dog, they used to do hard games. Jak & Daxter (1) was way too easy, and they got a lot of critique for that, and well deserved so. Jak II is more decently challenging, as I said earlier 3/10, but I could say 6/10 with all the challenges. I talked about Crash Bandicoot because that is what they did before Jak & Daxter. The first Crash Bandicoot game is one of hardest platformer games I know about on PS1. Crash Bandicoot 2 was rather easy, around Jak 2 game's difficulty and I've 100% that several times. Crash Bandicoot 3 was much harder to 100%, but you could also get 105%, which was much harder than that. Still nothing compared to CB1. Crash Team Racing had the Time Trials there too, beat Oxide's ghost on each track, about as hard as 105%-ing CB3. Loved doing that. Then they release Jak & Daxter (1), and it was way too easy. Jak II is going back a bit to what the difficulty used to be, but only when it was at it's easiest.

 

I know some people expect these "cartoon"-looking / "child-games" to be easy, but they didn't use to be that. R&C is easier than Jak, and Sly is even easier than that, but if you go back one generation and look at the games there by the same people you'd see why PS2 generation was easy and it's ridiculous how many people who complain when the game doesn't just let them win and they expect to breeze through them. This game isn't hard, but it doesn't just let you win either. Don't rush, just take your time and do it properly. I really wish we could have got a HD remake of PS1 games instead of PS2 though. I love my CB, Spyro and the original Rayman etc. I'd kill for a Tombi! trilogy in HD, would need to make a third game though!

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  • 3 weeks later...
I got (P) in Demon's Souls in 5 hours, and I messed up then, go check my trophy card. It's possible to do in 2,5 hours. xD

 

This is not the kind of game you play for just enjoying the story... It's Naughty Dog, they used to do hard games. Jak & Daxter (1) was way too easy, and they got a lot of critique for that, and well deserved so. Jak II is more decently challenging, as I said earlier 3/10, but I could say 6/10 with all the challenges. I talked about Crash Bandicoot because that is what they did before Jak & Daxter. The first Crash Bandicoot game is one of hardest platformer games I know about on PS1. Crash Bandicoot 2 was rather easy, around Jak 2 game's difficulty and I've 100% that several times. Crash Bandicoot 3 was much harder to 100%, but you could also get 105%, which was much harder than that. Still nothing compared to CB1. Crash Team Racing had the Time Trials there too, beat Oxide's ghost on each track, about as hard as 105%-ing CB3. Loved doing that. Then they release Jak & Daxter (1), and it was way too easy. Jak II is going back a bit to what the difficulty used to be, but only when it was at it's easiest.

 

I know some people expect these "cartoon"-looking / "child-games" to be easy, but they didn't use to be that. R&C is easier than Jak, and Sly is even easier than that, but if you go back one generation and look at the games there by the same people you'd see why PS2 generation was easy and it's ridiculous how many people who complain when the game doesn't just let them win and they expect to breeze through them. This game isn't hard, but it doesn't just let you win either. Don't rush, just take your time and do it properly. I really wish we could have got a HD remake of PS1 games instead of PS2 though. I love my CB, Spyro and the original Rayman etc. I'd kill for a Tombi! trilogy in HD, would need to make a third game though!

 

And don't quote me saying I hate because I suck at it because that's not true :).I'm just not into the Jak 2 story to be honest. I loved all the crash bandicoots and I got around 90% on all of them when I was 5-7years old. granted I played the shit out of them lmao:p. Yeah sly is too easy, even the challenges on Sly 3 were a breeze.

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The first Jak was amazing.

I'm working on Jak 2 currently and it sucks and it pisses me off.

I think naughty dog developers actually had the convo u stated lol.

The only reason I'm going to play Jak 3 is that I own collection & I heard it was better.

 

Agreed I am playing these for the first time and after beating Jak and Daxter and getting the platinum it was a load of fun but I am now playing Jak 2 and it sucks. I can't drive 2 seconds without hitting something and the turning circle is crap.

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Well this is unsettling... seeing people complain that the game is too hard? It certainly reflects how easy games have become nowadays then. I'll just start by saying the Jak and Daxter Trilogy basically was my childhood and it's still problem my favourite game series of all time.

However, I will also instantly say that Jak II isn't overly hard. I got the HD collection about a week ago and I've completed Jak 1 100% and I'm about halfway through Jak II.

The only "difficult" points for me are the racing segments (especially Errol's races) and that mission where you have to get the Mar's Seal piece from the Water Slums. Apart from that, I'm breezing through the rest of the game. I'm finding the driving weird but not unplayable as some seem to be claiming nor do I find the shooting to be "unnecessary". The aiming is fine and is actually quite good for a game that doesn't have any sort of zoom system.

Don't know, might be a difference in opinion but I don't see much wrong with Jak II other than the checkpoints can sometimes be hit or miss. That said, it could just be my nostalgic views of the series too haha.

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I got (P) in Demon's Souls in 5 hours, and I messed up then, go check my trophy card. It's possible to do in 2,5 hours. xD

 

This is not the kind of game you play for just enjoying the story... It's Naughty Dog, they used to do hard games. Jak & Daxter (1) was way too easy, and they got a lot of critique for that, and well deserved so. Jak II is more decently challenging, as I said earlier 3/10, but I could say 6/10 with all the challenges. I talked about Crash Bandicoot because that is what they did before Jak & Daxter. The first Crash Bandicoot game is one of hardest platformer games I know about on PS1. Crash Bandicoot 2 was rather easy, around Jak 2 game's difficulty and I've 100% that several times. Crash Bandicoot 3 was much harder to 100%, but you could also get 105%, which was much harder than that. Still nothing compared to CB1. Crash Team Racing had the Time Trials there too, beat Oxide's ghost on each track, about as hard as 105%-ing CB3. Loved doing that. Then they release Jak & Daxter (1), and it was way too easy. Jak II is going back a bit to what the difficulty used to be, but only when it was at it's easiest.

 

I know some people expect these "cartoon"-looking / "child-games" to be easy, but they didn't use to be that. R&C is easier than Jak, and Sly is even easier than that, but if you go back one generation and look at the games there by the same people you'd see why PS2 generation was easy and it's ridiculous how many people who complain when the game doesn't just let them win and they expect to breeze through them. This game isn't hard, but it doesn't just let you win either. Don't rush, just take your time and do it properly. I really wish we could have got a HD remake of PS1 games instead of PS2 though. I love my CB, Spyro and the original Rayman etc. I'd kill for a Tombi! trilogy in HD, would need to make a third game though!

 

Another thing is....Why did Jak 2 have to be hard? Look at Uncharted 1-3 and The Last of Us..... SOOOOO EASYYYY!!!!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Its definitely the hardest of the three, and the checkpoints are a bit messed.

Its not impossible - although i can't play for too long or i'm close to chucking things......One to be done over time in little spurts. Jak I and III i really enjoyed, but II can get proper annoying.

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You guys are definitely terrible at this game, i played as a little kid and it wasn't hard at all and i played the HD version again and i only died from wrong jumps.

 

So yeah, practice makes it perfect but please don't say a game sucks because since you are not a developer you have no idea how much time/money were wasted for these games to be made.

 

All the coding...brainstorming, all the ideas that were left behind...

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Naughty Dog Developer 1: "Hmmm, I know.. lets take all of the charm and excitement the first game had and get rid of it"

 

Naughty Dog Developer 2: "Ahhh yes.. thats a brilliant idea. we should also needlessly make it like GTA3 except water it down so its 500 times worse"

 

Naughty Dog Developer 1: "YES! and even though our target audience is 11year olds.. we can make some bits stupidly fucking difficult and frustrating so even grown-ups have a hard time enjoying it"

 

Naughty Dog Developer 2: "Ahhh" *wipes away pre-cum*

 

...based upon how mind-numbingly frustrating and dull this one is i'm not going to be playing it's sequel. fuck that. Even though i seem to remember enjoying them as a kid.. i'm not going to put myself through that again. dont get me wrong... the first one was one great. but i really feel they fucked the dog on this one. many of you will share my anger.

your loss for not liking it.

You guys are definitely terrible at this game, i played as a little kid and it wasn't hard at all and i played the HD version again and i only died from wrong jumps.

 

So yeah, practice makes it perfect but please don't say a game sucks because since you are not a developer you have no idea how much time/money were wasted for these games to be made.

 

All the coding...brainstorming, all the ideas that were left behind...

 

exactly what you said is 100% true, i didn't find it hard at all.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I actually came here to voice this same concern. I thought the first one was tolerable, but the second game is killing me inside. I've said swear words I wasn't even sure existed due to some parts of this game. I just don't understand the point of making the game so hard at some parts, and a cake walk during others.

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Playing the first two games again for the Vita, they are both as bad as each other. Both have poor controls, frustrating camera angles and a lack of checkpoints. But I don't hate on the games, because that's what games were like back then.

 

These games were acclaimed by critics and fans, with people who were players when they first came out citing Jak II as the best game. Pretty shocking, considering how people call it the worst game ever nowadays. Play a game that's a decade old with an open mind.

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Playing the first two games again for the Vita, they are both as bad as each other. Both have poor controls, frustrating camera angles and a lack of checkpoints. But I don't hate on the games, because that's what games were like back then.

 

These games were acclaimed by critics and fans, with people who were players when they first came out citing Jak II as the best game. Pretty shocking, considering how people call it the worst game ever nowadays. Play a game that's a decade old with an open mind.

 

For me a lot of the problem probably stems from the Ratchet and Clank Collection and the fact that I only played the Precursor Legacy on the PS2.

 

All these years I'd been blind to what they'd done in Jak 2 and 3 and playing them in the HD collection I was rather annoyed that the simple on foot level progression had been replaced with a bigger world that was only needed to satisfy travelling around on a hoverbike which just drew the game out (also as a result of stupidly placed mission markers and the need to backtrack to them all the time). The story and setting also went from light hearted to dark and gloomy; which I thought would be rectified at some point during 2 but no, Jak stays an asshole and continues to be an asshole in 3. Daxter's humour is more or less the same but he had less people and opportunities to play off of like Samos in the first game. It's just frustrating to see that they changed the game so much in the space of one iteration.

 

Onto why Ratchet and Clank makes this worse, the Ratchet and Clank collection (if you play it before the J&D collection like I did) sets the standard for HD remakes. Sure it has it's issues but for the most part that series aged a lot better than J&D and that's coupled with the series generally performing better than J&D in its own era anyway. The camera controls feel familiar to current standards, it's not horrible graphically (not that Jak is either) and the games are relatively consistent compared to J&D. You can go from game to game and expect more or less the same experience if not executed a little better. Whereas playing through the R&C collection you can feel each game getting better, J&D starts on a high and then fails to match it in its sequels. It's understandable then that I was disappointed when the same pattern of improvement was absent in J&D and that were it not for me whoring THL trophies at the time, Jak 2 would have remained incomplete and Jak 3 untouched.

 

Basically I wasn't pissed at Jak 2 or 3 because they play like shit compared to today's games. I'd like to think I can appreciate what a game was for it's time (GTA 3 is a good example but for another time). I was pissed because it changed what I loved about the first game and that it doesn't compare to another recreation from the same era.

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  • 3 weeks later...

^^ Perfect explanation. Jak II took all the fun out of the first game and replaced the sunny beaches and tropical jungles with a cold, mechanical city where you're forced to backtrack over and over to fulfill the same boring objectives. The series pulled a total 180 in the span of one game and it's truly disappointing since the lighthearted tone of the first game never comes back in the sequel. The original Jak reminded me of Mario Sunshine (which I loved as a kid) but Jak II was too hollow and distant for me to ever enjoy, horrible controls and vehicle handling notwithstanding.

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I am so glad I did not buy this but got it free on PS+, really enjoyed the 1st Jak game (bought back memories of the PS2) but half way through Jak 2 and not enjoying it, as many people have said the controls are bad and vehicle handling is terrible, will play jak 3 one I have the plat on 2 as don't think I ever played it.

 

If they had a orb counter like the 1st game so you could see whats missing in each area that would have helped.

 

I suppose we can forgive Naughty Dog as they have given us Uncharted and The Last of Us

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For me a lot of the problem probably stems from the Ratchet and Clank Collection and the fact that I only played the Precursor Legacy on the PS2.

 

All these years I'd been blind to what they'd done in Jak 2 and 3 and playing them in the HD collection I was rather annoyed that the simple on foot level progression had been replaced with a bigger world that was only needed to satisfy travelling around on a hoverbike which just drew the game out (also as a result of stupidly placed mission markers and the need to backtrack to them all the time). The story and setting also went from light hearted to dark and gloomy; which I thought would be rectified at some point during 2 but no, Jak stays an asshole and continues to be an asshole in 3. Daxter's humour is more or less the same but he had less people and opportunities to play off of like Samos in the first game. It's just frustrating to see that they changed the game so much in the space of one iteration.

 

Onto why Ratchet and Clank makes this worse, the Ratchet and Clank collection (if you play it before the J&D collection like I did) sets the standard for HD remakes. Sure it has it's issues but for the most part that series aged a lot better than J&D and that's coupled with the series generally performing better than J&D in its own era anyway. The camera controls feel familiar to current standards, it's not horrible graphically (not that Jak is either) and the games are relatively consistent compared to J&D. You can go from game to game and expect more or less the same experience if not executed a little better. Whereas playing through the R&C collection you can feel each game getting better, J&D starts on a high and then fails to match it in its sequels. It's understandable then that I was disappointed when the same pattern of improvement was absent in J&D and that were it not for me whoring THL trophies at the time, Jak 2 would have remained incomplete and Jak 3 untouched.

 

Basically I wasn't pissed at Jak 2 or 3 because they play like shit compared to today's games. I'd like to think I can appreciate what a game was for it's time (GTA 3 is a good example but for another time). I was pissed because it changed what I loved about the first game and that it doesn't compare to another recreation from the same era.

 

One of the best posts I've read in a long time. I hated 2 with a passion, considering 1 is one of my favourite platformers, and I've had no desire to start 3 for a long time now.

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While I agree, you guys are missing out with Jak 3. Its a solid game, and a fair bit better than Jak 2 imo. But its more similar to Jak 2 than Jak 1.

 

Agreed with the the sentiments though. Jak 1 is like a Spyro the Dragon style of platformer. Jak 2 removes all the charm and is more a knock-off GTA3.

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